Yesterday, I received a call from Evans Cooling (Steve Pressley at the urging of Doug Evans). Nice guy and we exchanged background stories, apparently they are personally involved in racing etc. His first admission was that even though they had racing experience, the venture into the high performance?specialty markets (the markets official namesake) was something fairly new to them. His mission was to glean from me the issues with regard to the gasket statements (and ended up with some marketing info that may benifit both parties) that I had made in an earlier post (Flushing a Cooling System) about propylene glycol degradating CERTAIN gaskets materials.

I expressed to him that I was once again running the gauntlet on that one and would absolutely report back to him when all information is in from several of the pump guys. He agreed. He said that he was not aware of any problems per se with gaskets, but we both agreed that the "heavy duty construction paper" looking gaskets were not very qualitative (lack of plastic properties) and that the Felpros were the best there were....I would stick with them (all our products (Concept One Conversion Kits) will come equipped as such). It very well may be that the cheap gaskets will fail evenually ANYWAY and the surfactant properties of EVANS NPG+ may just hurry things along as a catylst! I have seen this happen with Water Wetter and these gaskets as well......only at the block and pump surface tho.

We discussed the NPG+ product at length and we DID NOT disagree on one single point about the product, it's application or it's properties. Apparently according to Steve, the old NPG was not providing the heat transfer and carrying properties of a conventional coolant and could not be moved adequately by most conventional waterpump systems. Something that I previously referred to as conductivity, specific heat measurements and viscosity (kinda the consistancy of a thin milkshake) of nonaqueous propylene gylcol in earlier posts. They came up with a newer improved product which they tweaked the mixture to come up with NPG+, considerably improving the viscosity (thinner), and to moreover improve the FLOW RATE (because the viscosity is less) to INCREASE the cooling ability of the media (not my words...his)...same thing with water...the more flow the more cooling. Basically, by thinning down the NPG+ the flow goes up and the heat "bucket brigade" improves dramatically, which in theory should. He went on to say that the combination of viscosity changes allowed the product to be used in conventional propulsion systems and tremendously improved the efficiency of the media. I noticed that the specific heat number, according to their specs, had improved. But still, admittingly by Steve, no where near the conductivity and specific heat number of water. But, this product has been successfully tweaked to be able to use it in YOUR application with a high flow water pump with no problems according to EVANS. A big marketing and application obsticle overcome in my opinion.

In-so-far as the argument over nucleate boiling (I know this bores most of you), we agreed on that one too, that this is a rare occurance in most properly designed systems and was an issue with engines with insufficient protection and design. This product would have a real big upper hand in stopping any hot spot formation against conventional cooling media, a real feature of the product.

I was surprised by the information that Steve gave up on pluses and minuses, but one of the more interesting analogies that he came up with for the safety of the product was that you can find propylene gylcol (a basic sugar)in children's cough medicine! What? I never thought of it as a food additive. Pretty safe stuff to say the least. He was also excited about the Detox product for ethyl glycol as well.....as am I.

The bottom line to this discussion and with the gasket issue asside (a good gasket takes away this concern), and the facts that it is superior boiling and freezing protection, the NPG+ is a product that is environmentally superior to other conventional systems, is attractive to customers that just don't want to mess with cooling systems flushes at all, is a better rust inhibitor than water based medias, and can be run safely up to the temperature point on your engine where YOU feel safe running where water might fail you and come out! (My recommendation is get to a safe place before you get to 250, regardless of cooling media....to save the engine and prevent a likely vapor lock, something that we haven't really mentioned in prior posts...it will boil the fuel out of the carb at those extreme temps and leave you literally high and dry).

The down side still remains the cost, it's ability to conduct and carry heat, but in most applications that may not be an issue either. If you think your systems capacity may be on the lean side (either in size or your geographic location) in it's ability to carry heat, then this product may be iffy for your application and only trial and error will show the true capabilities here. It would perform admirably in not boiling over, but it may just keep running the temperature up until you have to shut down or the fuel in your lines and carb are vapor locked.

It you have an application where the cooling system is fine, and you just don't want to fool with flushes etc every few years, then the Evans product is attractive. If you run the stuff for long enough, the ROI on the initial installation may make up for any cheaper changeouts on a frequent basis.

I hope this helps any of you out there understand this product better. It's a good product for certain applications and moreover is improving every day. It very well may be that in a year from now I will be marketing it for many applications.....who knows. Steve and I are already exchanging marketing ideas for the EVANS products, a productive adventure and learning experience on my part. Remember, I am the information junky!
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Steve Jack
SOUTHEASTERN GOODGUYS REP

Hi Steve, I've digested about everything you've posted and I have a question. On the old flatties, what was the cause of constant overheating when the thermostats were removed but when restrictors were installed to slow the flow down, all was (almost) well again.....I think Speedway still sells restrictors with various size holes in them.
Was this a flow problem?? The explanation I was always given is that the cooling fluid was moving thru the radiater too fast to normally cool off and dissapate the heat. Was this the case? Or, was it the fact that 2 water pumps were used and therefore the coolant did move too fast and caused cavitation and steam pockets? Talk about mental confusion! I have enough on my mental plate now and unfortunately, can't turn it off...lol Thanks for some very interesting posts to say the least and also the help you gave me when I had similiar problems..Fred P
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Fred P.

Fred, you did two things in putting the restrictors in place of a removed themostat. One is that you built pressure in the block/heads by introducing more restriction than just having unfettered flow there(like trying to clamp the end of a hose off when water is flowing thru it...pressure gets increased in front of the restriction), yet it was an improvement flow wise over a thermostatically controlled device and this accordingly helped to prevent cavitation and hot spot formation. Secondly, you introduced turbulence (restrictors stir it up pretty good) to the system, another good thing (see jumping in lake effect and laminar flow in article). Between the two, the problem got solved, the flow increased over a thermostatic aperature, and the pressure was kept at a reasonable level (something that is not done when just running without a thermostat and restrictor) and turbulence got introduced!

Hope this helps to understand what is happening.
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Steve Jack
SOUTHEASTERN GOODGUYS REP

Steve, just a quick guestion. What is the pressure in the block vs the radiator say with an 18 lb cap? Would you get any cooling from the high presure to the lower pressure simular to an A/C?

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Mike J

Mike, no.. there is rapid expansion of gases escaping from high pressure to a low pressure. As a result the volume of gas is cooled. There is no such dramatic expansion in a cooling system.

Pressures throughout the cooling system varies according to temperature, flow and how much air is in the system. For example, a reading at the radiator might be simply 12 PSI, but in the upper hose, again depending on it's size, the pressure could easily be 20 PSI for the same 12psi system. This is why you never put a radiator cap assembly in the upper hose whereas a relatively high tested cap of 22psi pressure now only has two PSI of insurance, surely will push cooling out going down the road!
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Steve Jack
SOUTHEASTERN GOODGUYS REP

Sorry Jack that was not ment for you personaly.I should have said all cooling tricks..I never got the pix's but e-mail is screwed up(as allways MIKE
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Drive like you stole it !!

Steve, My whole point was, Is`nt this miricle liquid in a can just duct taping the hole in the boat so to speak? If your cooling system is optimum, Shouldn`t that be sufficient? I`ve been building 400 smallblocks for a time now, which are notorious for overheating problems, but when properly prepped, and an excellent cooling system installed, I never encountered overheating problems. Case in point, My 55 Chevy had a blown 413 smallblock I ran for years without any overheating problems, including parades. I`m now running a 417 sb in my deuce, and it is a pretty serious race motor, with no problems with this one. None of my customers come back with overheating problems when they follow the guidelines of an efficient cooling system. I can however see it in racings stock cars, some drag cars, and most forms of racing where they use smaller radiators to save weight. Do average streetrodders need this coolant?

ED......I couldn't agree with you more! (shortest post I have done here!)
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Steve Jack
SOUTHEASTERN GOODGUYS REP

Do I get a star on the refridgerator? You get one for the short post. LOL

GEEEEEZE! I'm proud of both of you! Ed- check out the snowplow link ( i think you don't need a plow)

So the lesson girls and boys is build it correctly the first time and you wont need any of these super trick(expensive) water pumps ,pulleys or coolants. I just never have seen the problems in stuff i build.If you need a 4 page thought on the subject you need to get it to a real rod shop that will get it to cool. I am no rocket scientiest and have NO cooling problems with all the stuff i/we build. I guess if you baffle the public with bullship they will buy your product. I personally wont be using Evans or concept one or water or howard stewart or water weter,no need for it. Just engineering snake oil : ) I still think my stuff stays cool cause i use Griffin radaiators and common cents(misspelled on purpose) in EVERTHING.
MIK
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Drive like you stole it !!

Mik....you have it correct. Design and build it correctly from the beginning and it's a moot point!

I am disappointed that you didn't like the pics and information that I forwarded to you before anyone else got to see them?
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Steve Jack
SOUTHEASTERN GOODGUYS REP