'93 Cavalier....The things a bomb..Girlfriends first car..somethin' she can beat up being a fairly new driver. Anyway, this things got half a bazillion miles on the O'Meter (hand me down 3 times over and ran to hell and back all 3 owners...fair to average care with all 3 owners..I'm watching this thing like a hawk.) and now here in the last few weeks once in a while you try to stop and the pedal falls to the floor. This shows me signs of a problem with the master cylinder?...BUT, now the last 2 or 3 days (twice in the last 3) she goes to press the pedal and it wont go down without breaking your leg to get it down. Can we still pin point it to a problem with the master cylinder or are we looking at something wrong with the rotors? Sounds by the way she talks and by the way it feels that when the pedal dont go down without a fight somethings binding up somewhere. And when the pedal goes down on it's own, we talking master cylinder problems here or what? These new cars are too much for me.....If it's not a simple fix if I gotta drag it to the shop, they'll fix it......I've blown the rotors off 50,000 times thinking maybe dirt or somethings binding it but it still acts up.

Gimme the skinny, gang.......Big $$$? I dont wanna go dumping alot into it when we know she wont have it long seeing it's falling apart. If I gotta dig into the bank and get her something dependable I'm ready....thought about it before, now I'm REALLY ready.
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

" These new cars are too much for me...."
It's ten years old!
Gallon of premium and a road flare... fix it right up! ;^)

I think you need to put a M/C on it just to find out if that's not it, then go from there...
(Bet it's got a rusted/broken return sping in the M/C binding a cup,, I had something like that happen in a car once on a hydraulic clutch. would disengage but the secod you released any pressure the whole thng would by-pass and was just like side stepping the pedal it was a brokeen spring in the slav cyl. that was poking under the edge of the cup)

In the case of this car, it's had a rough 10 years! LOL Everything under the bodys been fixed or replaced at one point, and the body itself dont have a inch of straight tin. Wouldn't surprise me on the spring deal...everythings rusting on this thing (beginning to think the plastics gonna do it next LOL). This here is the first and last fix I'm gonna do to the brakes...This dont get it, CarMax will when I trade the thing in for some newer wheels. Pulled my brains out on a problem with the fuel injection a while ago...

Thanks Doc, I'll check it out...If nothing I can do fixes it, I'll take your bonfire idea into consideration. LOL
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

Question? Is the ABS lite on when this happens Does it Have ABS? To check for sure wheather or not the master is defective, I would disconnect the lines from the master cyl and plug the master cyl( to do this just get a couple of fittings and a propane torch and fill them with solder) thenthread them into the cyl ports and check to see if the pedal falls or holds that will answer the cyl problem, quick and easy.. if it has ABS that will still check the master. if it has ABS and the master cyl is o.k. then I suspect the bpmv assembly is defective (brake pressure modulator valve) About $650 Canadian cocos , but it can be bypassed by removing all the lines to it and installing t's to bypass the fluid going through the bpmv still will have base brakes but no ABS. let me know if you need any more help. I work with This stuff all day so I have access to a fair amout of information...Fatchuk
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I hope Chuck Berry,hotrods,and the fifties are forever......

Ditto on what Chuck said.
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awsum34

Nothing better than a good friends,good beer and street rods

Chuck, it does have ABS, but no lights coming on (at least she hasn't said anything, and I'm taking her word for it..and I cant cruise in it seeing how it dont have hand controls..stuck in this chair of mine and the feet dont work too well LOL). Still the M/C? I think she's got off work Tuesday so this'll be on the To Do list whatever day she's off. Shouldn't take too long to rip apart, go hunt parts down and slap back together.

Once it's fixed I guess I'll be the best guy in the world in her eyes....at least for a hour or so. LOL

Thanks for all the help gang! Gimme anything pre '72 and I'm a genius...Gimme anything fairly new, I'm stupid. LOL
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

Genius? ...Mmmmm...
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WPoC

Well the puzzel continues to cloud the the Cavier, darn, some of these words are easy to say but, hard to spell.. Well, Hmmmm!!!! lets see if I got this right, some times the pedal falls to the floor, sometimes it's hard to depress, and we got no brake lites being activated, and we have checked the fluid level and it's right up. So if we do a process of possibilities, If we only had a falling pedal, that could and often does turn out to be a master cyl but, we have this hard pedal thing which throws a monkey wrench into the mix. If we are not losing fliud from the system, that eliminates a wheel cyl or open line. No lites could mean we have a mechanical problem, as in theory at least if we had any loss of fluid that should set a lite off and a loss of brakes certainly never a hard pedal. I would be more able to make a diagnosis if only we had the ABS lite come on but, since we don't that leads us back to a mechanical problem but, not 100% proof that we don't have an ABS problem as it is not totaly uncomom for an electronicaly controlled device to fail and not set or store a code and set the lite off. We will asume ( insert carefull here) that we may have a mechanical problem, at this point, armed with the information I have at this end of the keyboard I would take a good look at the rear brakes, I have experienced some problems in these years of G.M. cars having problems with many rear drums and shoes that don't fit the radius of the drum properly, poor weak spring kits, and generaly miss adjusted,siezed adjusters on the rear causing some of the symtoms you are describing. I have access to much information I could send you through a private e-mail that others may not have any interest reading if you want. Just let me know and I will be glad to help Yah through it if'in I can, sometimes hard to diagnos this stuff from the keyboards.....hope this helps abit....Fatchuk
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I hope Chuck Berry,hotrods,and the fifties are forever......

Lemme rip this thing apart and do a little process of elimination here and once I can figure out what in the world is going on with this thing wether I rip into it or a shop does we'll go from there.....cause right about now I'm still ready to do the whole kerosene rain shower and turn the mother into a bonfire like no other and buy something more dependable.

I'll see whats up and we'll work from there after I get it tore down. If I gotta tear the thing apart bolt by bolt down to the LAST bolt I'll do it....even if I'm sent to the doghouse for a night or three.
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

I'II check in for yah and be around if'in I can help...Fatchuk
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I hope Chuck Berry,hotrods,and the fifties are forever......

Appreciate it! Thanks
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

"Gallon of premium and a road flare... fix it right up! ;^)"

At today's prices...is it worth a gallon of premium? LOL.
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phil


It's not a NOMAD, it's a Yeoman!
Not an engineer, but I DO drive a train.

Taking a long distance stab at it,I'd say master cylinder(thats why the pedal fades away) AND a possible booster check valve,supply line or worst case,a booster.
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Some day,I'm going to wipe that grin off my mother-in-laws face,by telling her what her daughter and I did in high school..........

Sounds like a Master. And control yourself....Stop blowing them rotors, People could be watching. ...lol
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WPoC

Ya dog...LOL

Gonna price the master and booster just incase....Should I bring a oxygen setup along with me to the parts store? Dont wanna drop when I hear the prices. LOL
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.

Grant, I think you had the righ idea of trading up...sounds like anything else would be a trade up..lol
The brakes could be just the tip of the money iceberg if the car is that much of a beater!! who knows, clean it up and put some ArmorAll wipe on the wheels and take some pics for EBay!! With gas being as high as it is and parts prices high, a small motor car of one of the imports may be the best choice right now...I hate to say "import" but right now, they seem to be the best on getting the best milage for the buck...(or $3 and 99.9 ¢'s)
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Fred P.

Either way, pretty soon it's going to the junk heap or a new owner. Gotta get the thing to stop right, then we'll clean it up and let the little lady decide what she wants to do with it and what she wants next. All I hear is Civic this Civic that....so it looks like thats what she'll be cruisin' around in, in the not so distant future.
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NSRA, DSRA- Lower Susquehanna Chapter, Wannabe freelance automotive Artist..Delivery35's illegitimate Son..I think, EdCroozers blood Nephew..somehow or another, JW's Great Great Grandson, and MrWillys younger brother from another mother.